Application Screenshots (General)
At 13 JUL 2004 03:25:19AM Donald Bakke wrote:
In preparation for a presentation on Graphical User Interface design that will be given at the next Revelation User's Conference in Las Vegas, I am asking for examples of OpenInsight application screenshots. I would need permission to do the following:
1. Present this screenshot within the presentation in its current form.
2. Present a screenshot of a modified version of this form within the presentation that I will be creating for comparison purposes.
3. Present the above screenshots in a white paper that will be handed out with the presentation and most likely included on the conference CD.
Names of developers, companies, and applications are not required and title bars can be modified if so desired. My purpose is not to find fault with or ridicule screens, but rather to help people see areas that commonly get overlooked by all developers (myself included.)
Single or multi-page (e.g. tabbed) screens are welcome. If multi-paged, then send one screenshot per page/tab.
In return, I will send back the screenshot of the modified version of the form with a report that documents all the changes and my personal recommendations.
All contributions are greatly appreciated. Thank you.
dbakke@srpcs.com
At 14 JUL 2004 08:03AM Steve Smith wrote:
OK, here's mine. The interface is 400 years old, so it probably could use updating. Can you improve the ergonomics for me? That's all that's important with this GUI - the ability to key notes in quickly.
Screenshot
Johann Sebastian Bach (1685-1750)
(BWV - the original "Works" program)
At 14 JUL 2004 08:48AM Donald Bakke wrote:
Steve,
Is this an OpenInsight application?
dbakke@srpcs.com
At 14 JUL 2004 03:42PM Gray Cunningham wrote:
Looks like Lotus "Notes" to me .
At 14 JUL 2004 04:09PM Steve Smith wrote:
My point is that there's more to user interfaces (such as hotkeys and mouse usage and ergonomics and hardware interfaces for input devices) than a screen snapshot can fully convey.
Windows determines the GUI and OpenInsight can call Windows for whatever it needs. So should there be any reason why this *isn't* OpenInsight?
At 15 JUL 2004 12:44AM Donald Bakke wrote:
Steve,
I am fully aware that (good) GUI extends beyond the realm of what is merely visual. Nevertheless, much of it lies in that realm and this is just one portion of my presentation.
Since you weren't in NOLA you don't know that I gave this presentation using 100% non-OI application screen shots. I want to use OI screens and controls because that's what OI developers have to work with. It is far more meaningful to make recommendations upon those things that OI developers normally deal with rather than notes on a staff.
Your comments are well taken…but it almost came off feeling like a criticism. I know you better than that so I will assume that I am probably just getting a little tired from the recent OI three-day training class I just completed today.
dbakke@srpcs.com
At 15 JUL 2004 03:31AM Colin Rule wrote:
Don
I have emailed some screens for you
Colin
At 15 JUL 2004 08:39PM Steve Smith wrote:
Don, perhaps I was being a tad too "provocative".
Let me translate how I perceived your initial post - "send me some GUI snapshots of your OI applications and we'll show you how to do these better". This is at once helpful and constructive and yet might optionally be construed as lofty. I infer from the post that you will be promoting your Tab control for OI in Las Vegas in 2005?
I guess we both want for OI the ability to use a greater diversity of controls (perhaps 3rd party GUI controls). I know there are some new SRPCS controls which have had glowing feedback from the developers I have spoken with after NOLA.
Some applications require developers to render unusual and yet appealing interfaces - which for OI has been mentioned in Sprezzatura's SENL articles, and also in Sydney some 2+ years ago, where Sprezzatura showed a medical system (if I recall) and demonstrated how to alter OI's GUI dramatically - which impressed those who attended.
My thinking was that there are some cases where improving a GUI would be difficult just by virtue of a screen snapshot alone. What might present more value in assessing GUI options would be a video of the application in use, and not merely a screen snapshot. Then you get to rate the handling as well as appraise the 2D appearance/cosmetics.
Better still would be a freestanding process/tool that you could run over any GUI to (a) diagnose it (b) make the GUI features consistent across the entire application (eg. popup support, help, alignment), and © identify where the application can be made more streamlined and convenient for the user. Like a GUI / look-feel "wizard".
I know similar tools exist for AREV applications, so it is maybe feasible to think along similar lines for OpenInsight. Thinking out loud here.
As for NOLA - I wish I could have been there.
At 15 JUL 2004 11:47PM Donald Bakke wrote:
Steve,
Let me translate how I perceived your initial post - "send me some GUI snapshots of your OI applications and we'll show you how to do these better". This is at once helpful and constructive and yet might optionally be construed as lofty.
I can respect this. It was not my intent to be lofty or pretentious. I'm not sure how I could have worded it any better. I had hoped that my original wording would have made it clear that I consider myself (and all of SRP) as victims of the same problems others have. It is not a matter of "we're better and you're not". Rather, I am trying to formalize this issue by presenting some objective (as well as some subjective) standards to follow.
Consistency in the UI is one of those *objective* areas that I focus on. Yet, I have found that if I don't formalize standards for my own applications then it becomes easier to drift off and miss the mark. Some people have developed GUI systems for years and have never grasped that concept. Therefore my goal was to present concepts that would be welcomed without feeling that we were exalting ourselves in the process. If I communicated otherwise I apologize.
I infer from the post that you will be promoting your Tab control for OI in Las Vegas in 2005?
My post had no purposeful reference to our Tab control. I welcomed tabbed or multi-page screens merely because consistency and layout challenges often exist in these types of forms. I requested all the pages for that purpose, i.e. so we could see the problems that come up with content does not evenly spread out among all the pages of a tabbed form (among others.)
Having said that, I will admit that we did promote our Tab (as well as other) OLE controls at our vendor booth. None of our presentations made any mention of our controls despite the fact that we included a disclaimer in our presentation blurb that we would show how they could be used to enhance the GUI. We are very grateful to David Goddard for using our controls in his OLE presentation.
It really was (and is) my sincere desire to show people how to achieve better results with the tools they have. It might take more work but I know that great looking and functioning applications can be made with OI and its native controls.
I know there are some new SRPCS controls which have had glowing feedback from the developers I have spoken with after NOLA.
I am very glad to hear that! Thank you for the report.
My thinking was that there are some cases where improving a GUI would be difficult just by virtue of a screen snapshot alone. What might present more value in assessing GUI options would be a video of the application in use, and not merely a screen snapshot. Then you get to rate the handling as well as appraise the 2D appearance/cosmetics.
I think you have excellent ideas. Unfortunately there isn't that much time (as you know) in these presentations. There will be even less time in Las Vegas.
As you know, GUI design is not trivial. Depending on their training and experience, people will be different levels of ability. My presentation probably targets the more novice GUI developer, especially those who are still struggling with making the transition from AREV (character based) UI to OI (graphical based) UI. This was also described in my presentation blurb for NOLA.
Therefore I can only introduce so much before the material begins to "spill over the cup" due to information overload.
Better still would be a freestanding process/tool that you could run over any GUI to (a) diagnose it (b) make the GUI features consistent across the entire application (eg. popup support, help, alignment), and © identify where the application can be made more streamlined and convenient for the user. Like a GUI / look-feel "wizard". I know similar tools exist for AREV applications, so it is maybe feasible to think along similar lines for OpenInsight. Thinking out loud here.
If you can design one of these for OI then I'll be your first paying customer!
As for NOLA - I wish I could have been there.
Me too. I had hoped to see you there since we only had a brief opportunity to meet at the 2002 conference. Hopefully you will be with all of us in 2005.
dbakke@srpcs.com